Will the Real RDs Please Stand Up #SANE

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Jonathan: Hey everyone Jonathan Bailor here. I am very excited because we’re going to do, we’re going to, we’re going to blow the roof off some things today because we have, we have an awesome and courageous guest with us today. Her name is Dietitian Cassie. She’s online all over the place, spreading awesome nutrition information. She’s at dietitiancassie.com, on Facebook dieticiancassie, on twitter @dieticiancassie.

The thing that’s so special about Dietician Cassie, excuse me Cassie is that she is a Registered Dietician and she’s a registered dietician who, let’s put it this way, reflects the research rather than the dogma. This is not at all to put down registered dieticians at all. Cassie will tell us about the extensive, extensive training dieticians go through but Cassie is being kind enough to come on the show to talk about this paradox where people often turn to dieticians as experts.

If these individuals are being taught that the disproven theories of 40 years ago what do we do and I often get a question of people saying, “Jonathan should I even become an RD because if I am going to get taught these old, obsolete disproven theories, what good is it and certainly it does a lot of good. We need credential people and that’s what Cassie is going to tell us about but let’s us all give a round of applause for Cassie for coming in the show to talk about this. Because this is not an easy subject so Cassie I am over here. I’m clapping it up. I appreciate you coming to the show and addressing this tough issue with us, so welcome.

Cassie: Thank you so much Jonathan for the great introduction and for having me on your show today. I am so excited to be here and like you said, this is kind of a tough topic to talk about because I don’t want to undermine the RD credential all because it is a lot of training and there are so many great real food RD’s out there but at the same time, I love how you said that what I teach really reflects the research and not the dogma because not all registered dietitians are that way.

We are taught a lot of conventional wisdom approaches in school and people are searching for real nutritional truth. They’re exhausted fad diet where they’ve lose weight and all it comes back and more and more and they have switched from regular pop to diet and haven’t lost pounds or maybe eaten low fat and counted calories and points and morsels and everything else and it’s just not working for them.

I think that’s one thing that I find a lot of my practice is, my clients will come to me and say “Okay I have seen dietitians who have told me to eat this much and count my grains and eat more of this and that low fat. It’s just not working and gain weight and I’m frustrated and I’m exhausted and where do I go from here?”

That’s my passion is to teach people how to take research based nutritional concepts and make these fit into their everyday living no matter what their circumstances are. I really strive to teach people how to live a balanced life styles through real food and exercise and this is my one of my favorite parts about my life too is, I’m constantly striving to maintain this balance in my life. I’m excited to be here and talk to you today and answer any questions that you may have for me as well.

Jonathan: Oh, thank you so much Cassie. A couple things I want to get out right at the very beginning and that is my personal opinion if you’re an individual out there considering or not to become an RD, I would 100% say go for it and be awesome like Cassie, meaning get the credentials, the credentials matter and they’re really helpful. We need people in the inside and we need people on the outside.

Go become one of the people in the inside because you can make change that someone like me can’t but at the same time and Cassie I want you to tell us your story how you did this. Don’t let the dogma dominate you. Let the results and the science be what you reflect. Cassie how did you do that? Because if all these school I can imagine after awhile the famous quote “A lie told often enough becomes the truth.” How did you avoid being indoctrinated?

Cassie: That’s such a good question. Well my story as a registered dietitian goes way back. As far as I remembered, I’ve always been interested in nutrition, how the body works and I’ve always loved research, dissecting it, and implementing it, just learning about the new research studies. And my eye is always out there, watching for all the new studies coming out and I’ve always been an avid athlete, I was gymnast, now I’m a marathon runner.

I’ve always been interested in how what I ate affected my performance level and so I kind of took both my passions, my studies of the combination of nutrition and fitness and with the ever changing field of nutrition, I began to get questions all the time about what healthy and what’s not. This made me question everything I was taught. As a young practicing dietitian throughout my years of schooling, I really started digging in and researching, just doing my own research on top of all the research and stuff from my classes because I wanted everything that I applied to my own lifestyle along with the recommendation that I was giving friends and family, and patients in my clinical rotation and my internships, which I will mention in a second. I wanted everything to be based on current research and science and not just belief.

What you have to do to become a registered dietitian, is you have to get a four year undergraduate degree, so I did mine at Minnesota State University and then after you obtained this, to be a registered dietitian, you have to go through a really competitive process and get an ADA and now AND, Academy of Nutrition Dietetics, approved accredited internship.

In my college, and the statistics are about 50 percent of people who graduate with a four year degree in Nutrition Dietetics get one of these internships. They’re not really that, they’re not really in your favor for the first place, the statistics, they’re very tough to get and looks for students who are well rounded, not just good students but that hold a lot of leadership roles and do a lot of community work as well. I did get accepted to a pretty prestigious programs at the VA Hospital in Chicago and when you’re doing your internship you have a year.

It’s a full year of clinical rotations, you spend time on the cancer ward, in cardiology, and you go to surgeries, and you have research projects, and you take masters classes and it’s quite a rigorous program. Throughout all of this you’re taught conventional wisdom approaches. You’re taught what the FDA and the USDA, everything is based on their guidelines.

I was taught to treat heart disease with cheerios and oatmeal and margarine and definitely not butter or egg or cheese which surprisingly are not as what nowadays I encouraged my clients with heart disease to eat for breakfast every day. I was taught to, for diabetics 45-60 grams of carbohydrates per meal including rice and pasta and bread and all of those horrendous foods, Jonathan, that spikes blood sugar levels and aren’t really healthy for anyone.

I think there comes a point where you have to step back and look at what makes sense and evaluate just what you feel and believe in your own heart. And it never made sense to me that when you’re in a quest to be healthier you should eat 100 calorie pack snacks and consume sugary products because we all know that all those products that are lower in fats are higher in something, usually sugar, artificial sweetness.

Jonathan: Well Cassie here and here I just want the certainly, certainly these institutions and in these individuals who are in these programs, these are smart, incredibly smart people and the MD’s and the PhD’s that continued to prescribe for lack of better terms potato, white potatoes and white rice and whole grain bread to diabetics, when I’m sure when you’re in day one of learning anything nutritional from a biology perspectives we, you learned that if you drink a Coke or if you eat a whole grain bread when they leave your stomach, they are the same thing but we actually prescribed things that spike blood sugar to diabetics, you have to eat more of them. How does an educated, intelligent, person not have their brains explode when they hear that?

Cassie: It’s really hard. It’s really, really hard and it’s still hard because there are still, I get questions about that all the time especially a lot of my clients will come to me and say to me well my doctor said, “I need to make sure I’m having potatoes and bread at every single meal because I need those to balance my blood sugars.” It’s really hard for me work against the doctors so to speak.

I believe there are so many amazing, educated health care professionals; doctors and nurses and dieticians alike but I think that sometimes when you’re in your practice it’s so easy to get caught up and teaching what you’re practicing and what you’ve been practicing for the last 20, 30, 40 years. I think the difference is I am always reading the newest research and I spend most of my free time listening to podcasts like yours and Jimmy Moore’s and reading books all about these research studies and what actually working for people.

I think it’s just about being informed and trying to be out there and see what’s working and what’s not and I think one thing that you’ve mentioned and that in the beginning of the show Jonathan is that people are you know they’re frustrated and they actually they are feeling they are doing something wrong. They feel like they’re failure when here they’re trying to eat this way that they were told was supposed to be good for them and that they’re gaining more weight, their blood sugar levels aren’t under control and they usually have a bunch of other health complications along with it.

Jonathan: Well, Cassie I think you hit the nail on the head there when you said, there’s an important distinction and I think we need to bring to the surface and I think we also need to salute and applaud individuals like Registered Dietitians and Clinicians. People who spend…when you have eight plus hours a day booked, working with individuals, like that is your job. I was recently speaking with Dr. O who has another wonderful podcast and he talks about this model of rescue medicine, where someone comes in and they have acute conditions and you essentially need to rescue them and it’s almost this model of urgency, like you have a patient here with you.

You have a client here with you and that’s happening back to back to back and you’re just, you’re almost, think of it as an exaggerated analogy, think of it as a medic who is in the military in a battle time situation. They’re just trying to stop the bleeding. They’re just trying to help as many people as they can, as quickly as they can and their hearts are in the right place but if that person is so busy doing those types of things that like let’s continue that analogy. Maybe it won’t make sense, hopefully it will, that they don’t yet understand that for example having their hands cleaned before they touch a wound is extremely important or they might do more harm than good. Well, again it’s in some ways the responsibility of the people who are not on the front lines to make sure that the people who are on the front lines are educated.

Instead of may be blaming those people, people like you, people in the front lines where I wouldn’t blame anyway make sure you’re doing the right thing but I almost think individuals such as myself and people in the research community need to look inward and say “isn’t it the kind of our job to ensure that we’re getting the people on the front lines this information because you guys are the ones actually out there, one on one helping people and that takes a lot of time in and of itself. Right?”

Cassie: Well you’re right. It does takes a lot of time and I really like what you said about how a lot of these Clinicians who are teaching this outdated theories, this conventional wisdom, their heart really is at the right spot. I met so many doctors that really they’re so wonderful and they’re trying to see, like you said, as many people that possibly can, they are trying help all of their patients and they just aren’t always exposed to some of this new information. They really want to do what’s best and I think that’s the hard and frustrating part for me is that I just wish that everyone could somehow just be exposed to all of this new information that we just had all more time in a day.

Jonathan: Well Cassie, that’s why rolling back to some of the things we talked about earlier, that’s actually why I think it is so important for people like you to get the RD credentials and to get in on the inside because we all know, it’s human nature to be a bit of us versus them kind of the thing, where team A, team B, the famous study where they take children and you give some of them red arm bands and you give some of them blue arm bands and within two days, the red arm bands don’t like the blue arm bands.

The more we can have individuals with RD’s and with PhD’s and with MD’s bringing, sort of serving as a conduit, serving as a bridge between the more esoteric research community and then you’ve got the people in the front lines. If you could have that bridge I think that is so valuable. That’s why I encouraged people to get those credentials. What do you think?

Cassie: Yes, I think so too. I think that’s really important to be in the inside and even just to be when you’re inside that inner circle scene what is being taught, it’s hard because I feel for dietitians who, because I feel for their brainwashing at one point too. It’s really hard to reverse when these guidelines are being pushed at you from every direction, this is what you are being taught and I do like to use the word brainwash because I feel like that’s what it’s like because you’re being taught these specific guidelines and you’re not really being given anything else from anyone outside.

I get that and I think that gets really hard but I also think it’s really important. I think it’s important to be in that in that inner circle and be exposed to everything that registered dietitians are being taught but then use your own brain and question everything. Look around at all these other sources and analyze all the other research studies and their findings and see what’s being done and what’s being taught and what’s working and what’s not. I would absolutely encourage anyone thinking about going into a career in nutrition to get those RD credentials. I think that they do set you apart and I think it really, it really is important.

Jonathan: Cassie I think the good news, the good news is if we can if we can free our minds from one theory, I think, this becomes much easier because we’re talking about starts to become a little bit more commonsensical when people throw dogma at you, like someone can say one plus one equals three all day, you’re going to be kind of like but I have one rock and I have another rock and when I put them together there’s only two things here, so what you’re saying doesn’t make any sense and that one theory is the idea that a calorie is a calorie, so just eat 1,400 calories per day and you’re good to go.

` Once we stop believing that a calorie is all that matters and that food and biology and the beautiful complexity that is the human can be reduced to a calorie mathematical formula, then the idea that you should feed a diabetic foods that cause the thing you’re trying to avoid because they are low in fat and therefore they are low in calories doesn’t make any sense and the idea that like people call it The Paleo Diet. To me, it doesn’t make any sense. These people are simply advocating meat things you find directly in nature that have the most good stuff in it and the least bad stuff in it. How is that a diet?

Cassie: I hate the word diet. I know and I hate how the word diet is in that term Paleo diet because I also am the advocate of the Paleo diet. I think it’s great. I think it’s not a diet. I think it’s the lifestyle. I think it’s about making lifestyle changes and including fresh meats and fish and eggs and vegetables and healthy fats to balance your blood sugars all day long and stay full and it’s all real food. Yes, it really frustrates me that we have to use of the term ‘diet’ there but I think that you’re really on to something and I think once we get over this whole calorie concept, the USDA guidelines are based on balancing calories to maintain weight.

There’s still stuck on that notion that it’s all about calories when frankly it’s not. Weight maintenance is so much more about the quality of these calories not the quantity and what your body does with these calories. The role of the hormones like Glucagon, Insulin, Ghrelin and Leptin. There’s so much…sleep, there’s so much more that goes into it and I think that people are people are begging for this. They’re hungry for this. They’re craving something different.

They’ve exhausted every diet, pill and potion out there and they’re looking for something that’s actually going to work long term. I hear this all the time in the community, enrichment classes that I teach and the clients I coach. Once you explain some of these basics concepts to them it actually makes sense and when it clicks and it makes sense that’s why people are motivated to make changes and when they start seeing positive changes in their own bodies that’s when all of these comes together.

Jonathan: Absolutely and that’s funny that you said they’re hungry for something different because that’s probably true on two levels. One, they are hungry because they’re starving themselves and two, there’s this kind of horrible cognitive dissonance between being taught something, which as soon as someone…and the funny thing Cassie is that like intuitively we know these. It’s just like its being, it’s almost like we forgot like everyone knows, everyone knows that eating 140 calories of Coke is not the same as not eating 140 calories of spinach like we all know that that is true.

Cassie: Yes.

Jonathan: But when food manufacturers and even the USDA keep telling us otherwise we just forget it like it’s just we have so much going on in our lives. It’s just like what is in front of me right now? What’s constantly being told to me. Same thing with weight. We know that what you weigh is really not a good indication of anything. There’s healthy people that weigh a lot, there’s unhealthy people that weigh a little. There are people like myself who are technically obese according to their weight but if you saw me, you would not say that I’m not obese. We know that but we’re constantly inundated with that dogma, it’s like we have…the fortunate thing that not only do we have science on our side I believe, but we also have common sense on our sides and because of that, I think we’re going to win out. I think it’s just going to take some time.

Cassie: Yes, I love that. We do have common sense on our sides and I think that like I said when people really take a step back and they really look at all of these different diets that they have tried and different things that they have counted in order to maintain their weight and being healthy, they step back and they’re like you know what it really it doesn’t make sense.

It doesn’t make sense to me eating all these diet foods, bars and shakes and foods that’s delivered to my door step, I just want to eat real food. I’ve heard that so many times. I just want to be normal and eat real foods because it just seems like it’s the right thing to do and it is because our bodies were designed to metabolize real food, not these package and processed and refined food products.

Jonathan: Oh, absolutely, you talk about counting things. I think one of the challenges with some of this stuff too is that there is this kind of intuitive, in some ways it’s like… Here is an example, if someone tells you and you didn’t know anything better that the earth is flat, you’d be like okay, yes, that makes a lot of sense, I’m looking outside and it must be flat because if it wasn’t flat, like we’d fall off. It kind of makes sense when you look around and if you think about it yes, the earth is flat. But of course that’s not true and when you think about it like yes you know it’s just calories in and calories out, a calorie is a calorie. Okay that’s cool but it’s actually not true so…

Cassie: Fat makes you fat, right?

Jonathan: Exactly. It’s like well, it’s almost like there’s common sense on both sides but it’s like you have to have…once you understand gravity, it kind of make sense that the world isn’t flat. Once you understand the solar system you’re like it’s obvious that the earth isn’t flat. I got it now and once you understand for example, maybe hormones and once you understand even baseline understanding what your body does to food once you eat it, beside just being a calorie factory, then this I call it, the flat earth theory of the weight loss becomes just that. It becomes what seems commonsensical becomes absurd in favor of actual common sense, which is that food is more than just calories.

Cassie: Yes. Yes it is and that’s what I love having the opportunity to sit down with people and teach them some of these concepts. Like you said, once you get to the underlined science behind it and explain how hormones works and explain blood sugar regulation and how that helps balance weight and everything else, people really starts to get it and that becomes the motivator for change and when they… I don’t think people really want to know every single specific detail, some do but I think others just want a general explanation and once that makes sense to them, they’re just like “oh, I get it. I get how it works now and I’m not afraid to eat fat,” but before they understand that when they’re just brainwash with all these low fat, fat free, skinny, light, when they’re not getting their information from science. When they’re looking at marketing and people that are just trying to sell them stuff. Of course we get those messages from every direction and on billboards and food products, and TV, and radio commercials and it’s no wonder why people are confused.

Jonathan: Oh, absolutely and it’s funny too because we talk about counting things and I think it’s just another example of what we talk about where it’s common sense versus common sense in some ways because like people say “Oh yeah, just need to count calories” and then okay yes I can see why would that work. That seems commonsensical. What I often find, I’m curious what do you think about this Cassie, is like okay let’s imagine that you…let’s imagine that human health is only possible if you count calories.

Okay let’s assume that’s true. Why don’t we need to count electrolytes in and electrolytes out and why don’t we need to consciously monitor our blood sugar levels when we’re not diabetic? Why doesn’t every human being on earth need to consciously monitor their blood sugar levels or their blood pressure or the amount of Vitamin C they’re taking in or even the phosphorus they’re taking, the amount of magnesium they’re taking in. If we actually need to consciously regulate things we put into our body then why don’t we have to consciously regulate all of the things we put into our body, not just one of them?

Cassie: Yes why do we just pick one specific thing, that’s a good point. I think like you said the calorie counting concept, it’s a very flawed theory but people are still a little confused about it because when they tried diet program X, it had them counting calories and they’ve lost some weight, granted they gained it all back and an extra 20 pounds on top of it but something about it seems to work so it makes them tempted to go back to that and try it again when they’re desperate. Usually, when I take a step back and look at what they’re really doing and they tell me a little bit more about the specifics of diet program X they were probably eating a lot healthier. They were probably cutting out sugar, pretty much every diet on the planet that’s successful always cut out sugar. There you go, that’s going to be really, really helpful right there.

They’re probably eating more vegetables and maybe some fruits that are lower in sugar, so that’s going to be really helpful and so there’s certain concepts that you can follow a diet and maybe have some success on it because usually people are doing a lot more than just counting calories. If they were just eating a bunch of 100 calorie packs all day long, I’m not quite sure how that will work or how anyone has done something like that but there’s just so much more to it, Jonathan.

Jonathan: Oh, absolutely, an analogy and a point that I think maybe helpful for folks because they were in transformative to me. Gary Taubes and Adam Kosloff talked about something which is very fascinating which is kind of what you just mentioned, where if you are like the typical American and you get about 60-65 percent of your calorie, if not more from processed starches and sweets and refined seed oils.

If you cut your calorie intake half, the thing you are most reducing in your diet is the poisonous things we just listed, which are the things that are making you fat in the first place. It’s not actually necessarily that you’re cutting your calories. It’s that the act of cutting calories reduced the amount of poison you’re ingesting, so you’re getting better.

Cassie: Yes, I love that. I think a lot of people hear you say the word poison and think “what?”. I think a lot of the foods that we are putting in our body, especially these diet foods and food substitutes are poison. Margarine is made in a lab, it’s not natural a lot of artificial sweeteners I really encourage people to not use these. They’re not natural, they were not on planet earth ever. They where manufactured in a lab and these are things that we just need to remind ourselves of and get back to the basics of eating real nutritious foods that our bodies were designed to run on.

Jonathan: Oh, absolutely and an analogy of this I just thought of this just now Cassie so you might have to unpack this and reel me in because I don’t know if this will work. We talked about, I went on that calorie counting program and I saw results, we talked about, and well, maybe that’s because something else happened that really wasn’t the active reducing calories. It was reducing something else, so here’s an analogy, let’s say that someone is like “I have this pill. It’s going to help you feel better. It’s going to enhance your mood. It’s probably going to make you, it’s probably used as a happy pill and okay actually…”

Cassie: The happy pill, okay.

Jonathan: Happy pill. It’s a happy pill and the happy pill is actually just a gel capsule filled with water but let’s not tell anyone. Let’s not tell…it’s a tiny tiny pill. But let’s say to get the happy pill, you need to go outside in the sun, you need to put some headphones on and have some like a very uplifting music and you have to walk in the sun for 20 minutes to get to the store that’s going to give you these happy pills.

You start taking these happy pills and you do this every day. You go, you’re listening to the very uplifting and positive music. You’re out in the sun. You’re walking for 20 minutes and you’re like, “Man I am feeling better like these happy pills really work. They’re making me feel…”

Cassie: They’re making you happy.

Jonathan: Whereas, in reality, it’s actually these other things that you were doing, not that pill…

Cassie: Yes.

Jonathan: That are actually making you happy. The only reason I mentioned this somewhat stupid story, is if for the individuals who are in that place, which is a very real place that I think so many of us have experienced where they’re like “Well when I just stopped eating, I get results.” That’s happening because you’re eliminating these certain metabolically destructive substances and you can eliminate those and still eat and you’ll even get better results when you do that. When you don’t just eliminate the bad but you eliminate the bad and you’ll replace it with the good. What do you think?

Cassie: Exactly and I think a lot of people failed to see that aspect of it. I love that happy pill analogy. That’s such a great visualization, especially compared to diets because I think that’s just exactly how I feel about diets. When people are confused how they got a little bit of a success from trying this one diet that’s what I was trying to say about how they’re doing all of these other things. A lot of the diets I see are encouraging them to maybe exercise a little bit and eat some more vegetables and cut out their sugars and they’re doing other things and then they are like I think these sugary, or they don’t say sugar they tell me this diet shakes that are helping them…[crosstalk 29:34]

Jonathan: Exactly.

Cassie: That have about 25-40 grams of sugar, just the same amount as a couple of candy bars or a can of pop but they’re drinking these things and thinking that they’re working. They’re really all of these other positive changes that they’re making and I think that is just so common in our culture.

Jonathan: I think it’s just so wonderful that we have individuals like you who can go, let’s call it like inside the belly of the dragon. You can go on the inside and champion this because and folks, I would really encourage you that if you haven’t checked out Cassie’s work, check out dietitiancassie.com. Check her out on Facebook, which is @dieticiancassie, find her on Facebook because individuals like Cassie are…It’s easy for me to say these kinds of things because my livelihood isn’t tied to a professional affiliation with an association and for an individual, whose livelihood is tied to that, to in some ways represent or say things that may be in conflict with that organization, that takes a level of courage and just fortitude, which I admire and I think we as an individuals need to support people like you Cassie. It’s easy for us on the outside to say “blah, blah, blah, that’s wrong and bad” but for people who have got to work with other people who think the traditional flat earth theory of weight loss, it takes a lot more courage and we should be sensitive to that.

I think we should appreciate that, so thank you Cassie. Listeners, if there’s anything that you can do to support people like Cassie or even some of the MD’s that are speaking against this, I mean let’s look Cassie here’s an example. What happened to Dr Atkins? He was kind of shunned from the nutritional community when frankly 50 years later were kind of being like “You know, Robert Atkins was kind of on to something.”

Cassie: Yes, exactly and I think there is something like you’re saying about this being inside that dragons tummy and just seeing these people and what their being inside the thought processes and seeing what’s going on in the world of dietitians and with the real world. I think that’s what I love about my job because I get to work with health care professionals but then I also get to work with real people and really helped them apply these complicated nutritional concepts which really a very basic and just helped them break it down, break it down, bring it back to the basics and apply it to their own lives.

On my blog, I try to put up a post each week about things that I have learned from my clients and different research studies that I have read, diet strategies that people are constantly coming to me and telling me that they’re trying that really aren’t working. I just encourage people to just really get out there and learn this stuff for yourself and what, when you’re in doubt just try something for yourself and see how it works. I think that’s the one thing that people will say, well you really think that I’ll feel good if I eat eggs for breakfast. I like my cereals and I say just try it, try it for a week and come back and tell me how you feel and I’ve had never had anyone tell me that they go back to cereal. Never, so sometimes you just have to try it for yourself and see how your own health improves.

Jonathan: Absolutely and also I would say if you’re trying to do something to increase your health, there’s one exception here but if you’re trying to do something to improve your health, and it makes you feel like crap. That’s probably a good sign that’s it’s not actually helping your health. The one exception is if you’re addicted to sugar and starch, which is now a demonstrated phenomena, you’re going to feel, you’re going to go through withdrawal just like anyone who’s getting off in an addictive substance that will go through. But if, let’s say after four weeks, what you’re doing is making you feel tired and lethargic and crappy, chances are it’s not really helping you.

Cassie: Yes you should have enough energy to make it through your work day and come home and play with your kids and make dinner and maybe even go out for a little walk and you shouldn’t feel exhausted and fatigued and deprived of your life. You want to be able to live this life to the fullest and I really believed that if you’re eating real food and have the proper nutrition you’re going to feel great.

Jonathan: I love it. I love it Cassie, I couldn’t put it any better myself and folks let us all applaud one more time, Dietitian Cassie.

Cassie: Thank you so much. It’s fun to be here today.

Jonathan: Oh, it’s great Cassie because you know like I said it takes, it’s much different being in your position and doing what you are doing. It takes a lot of courage so we salute you and please folks check out dietitiancassie.com. Give her a like on Facebook, follow her on twitter @dieticiancassie and remember this week and every week after eat more and exercise less, but do it smarter. Talk to you soon.